PSP Logs from Friday October 16

<eagel> If you have no questions please type
<eagel> /nick z-yournick
<eagel> To have any user that uses your nick disconnected if they dont 
match your access mask
<eagel>  and dont know your nick password, set kill on.
<eagel> Type this:  /msg NickServ  SET KILL  ON
        Had to leave this LOL 
<zIsis`> Random thought: Success always occurs in private, and failure in full view.
         
<eagel>  Eagel's Fall Nest for study group, logs, class info and urls.
<eagel> http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Ranch/3421/enfall.html

<eagel> If you have a questions please type
<eagel> /nick a-yournick

<eagel>  I cant even get the cropping tool under control yet. But thanks
<Leapin> eagel what problem are you having with it?
<eagel> just a steady hand and I wish it was a circle and not a rectangle
<Leapin> eagel propose that circle cropper idea to jasc for version 6
<Leapin> I bet they would love the idea too
<eagel> someone was asking about checkerboard earlier and saving as .psp vs .gif

<z-Sassykat> is anyone going to save this class and post it anywhere?
<MrBones> notes form this class can be found at

<Leapin> okay everyone we will get started
<Leapin> before moderating I will give a quick reminder of how this works
<Leapin> once we moderate you will not be able to type to channel
<Leapin> if you have a question type..
<Leapin>  /nick A-yournickname
<Leapin> that will move you to the question area
<Leapin> if you DO NOT have a question type...
<Leapin>  /nick Z-yournickname
<Leapin> if during the class you were Z (no question) and now have a 
question just change to A-yournick
<Leapin> by typing
<Leapin>  /nick A-yournick
<Leapin> does that all make sense?
<Leapin> okay we will begin now
<Leapin> when you get a + by your nickname
<Leapin> that means we have voiced you
<Leapin> you can now type to channel
<a-catherine> with the evaluation copy of PSP is it not complete? 
 I get greyscale when I use flood fill or retouch
<a-Augustus> Pleases explain what the hardness and opacity means.
<Leapin> opacity is how see through the image or selection will be
<Leapin> opacity at 100 setting is not see through
<Leapin> opacity at 0 setting is completely see through or transparent
<Leapin> opacity at 50 is part transparent and part not
<Leapin> that is the simplist terms I can put it in
<Leapin> was opacity answered okay augustus?
<a-Augustus> yes, now hardness
<Leapin> hardness is how dark or light you want the colour you are putting
 into an image on
<Leapin> a hardness of 100 makes the colour its full shade
<Leapin> a hardness of 5 makes it very light almost none existant
<Leapin> do you see the difference?
<a-Augustus> what is the best general setting
<Leapin> augustus it really depends on the type of effect you are trying 
to achieve, for instance
<Leapin> if you want the colour exactly as you picked it from the colour
 palette, than 100 would be the best
<Leapin> however if you want a softer effect than maybe 50 or less would 
serve that need
<a-Augustus> ok, ill z now
<Leapin> it is really up to you as the designer to decide what is the best setting

<eagel> When you have had your question answered, please Thank Leapin 
and we will move on.
<eagel> Also if you have your question typed into the bar , you can just 
hit enter when it is your turn

<a-catherine> Is the evaluations copy not complete? I get greyscale when 
I use the flood fill and a notice that with retouch only 24 bit color or greyscale 
<Leapin> catherine Is your image in 16 million colours?
<a-catherine> yes
<Leapin> what colour is your background and foreground set to?
<Leapin> if black and white, that might be why you are getting grey
<a-catherine> background was white and forground was blue
<Leapin> what flood fill mode are you using?
<Leapin> try setting it to normal and see if you get the effect you want
<a-catherine> I'll try it again but I do remember trying to get flood fill
 with a red dropper chosen and only getting gray fill
<Leapin> also If you have the flood fill tool selected it should not be
 talking about the retouch tool
<Leapin> make sure you have the flood fill tool selected, not the retouch tool
<a-catherine> I mentioned both because the gray default seemed to happen 
with those two not at the same time though of course
<Leapin> catherine let me know how you make out please graphics@vu.org 
if you do not retry before class ends
<a-catherine> I'm supposing that it is the evaluation copy since 
I don't have many tubes either.
<Leapin> catherine you can download extra tubes at the http://www.jasc.com site
<Granny-Wicked> Leapin should she check her opacity?
<Leapin> or at least you used to be able to
<a-catherine> I'll let you know after more tests, thanks leapin I'll let 
someone else have voice. THX
<Leapin> catherine yes gw is right also check your opacity, make sure it 
is not too low
<Granny-Wicked> if they opacity is set low the actuall color will be less
 then you see on the color chart

<acandyk> does the hardness value effect file size
<Leapin> no candyk (mom) not that I know of

<aSassykat> where is a copy of the transcript of this class to be posted,
 please? in case we lose our connection?
<eagel>  Eagel's Fall Nest for study group, logs, class info and urls.
<eagel> http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Ranch/3421/enfall.html
<eagel> under psp

<a-Isis`> I'm going to scan a picture.  What file format if I can't save it 
as PSP is best?
<Leapin> .tiff
<Leapin> if you have .tiff it is best
<a-candyk> i thought bitmap was best for reediting on c
<Leapin> candyk tiff for scanning or .bmp 

<a-mykidsmom> Two questions, what is Step. Should we tell how we made our 
imgages on our web page?
<Leapin> both are lossless - to be explained in next lesson
<a-mykidsmom> thanks I think
<Leapin> mykidsmom step is the distance between where..
<Leapin> one item will be placed and the next
<Leapin> a low step setting, let's say with tubes at a step setting of 1..
<Leapin> will place the tubes overlapping each other
<Leapin> a high step setting, again with tubes, like a setting of 50 will
 place a gap between placement on the canvas
<Leapin> is that making sense?
<a-mykidsmom> so when I am making a button step dosn't matter
<Leapin> it depends, let's say you are using a paintbrush..
<Leapin> with a brick pattern
<Leapin> step will matter, because the step setting defines how far apart or 
close each brush stroke will be
<Leapin> step works the same with any tool that has step as a setting in its 
control palette

<a-Rhebeka> How do you get the clone tool to clone an area that is different 
distances from the are where you want it to clone?
<Leapin> rhebeka could you explain a little further, I am not sure what you 
mean as of yet?
<a-Rhebeka> Well, I can't clone anything that is more than a few pixels away 
from the source.
<a-Rhebeka> is there a way to adjust the clone distance?
<Leapin> You start your clone where you first right click
<Leapin> if you want to do a series of clones, right click one area and then 
left click to clone
<a-Rhebeka> do you right click on the source or where you want the clone to end up
<Leapin> than change where you want the next clone to start by again right clicking
<Granny-Wicked> right mouse click the move to the area you want to use, and 
left mouse click the color in where you want to place it
<Leapin> you right click the area you want to clone
<Leapin> the original image
<Leapin> is that answering your question rhebeka?
<a-Rhebeka> ok, I understand that but I still cant get it to clone an inch 
or more, If I want to clone a part of an image say a tree from a picture
<Granny-Wicked> right mouse click then move to the area you want to use,
 and left mouse click the color in where you want to place it
<Leapin> sometimes, depending on your image you have to do several short clones
<Leapin> to get the whole area
<Leapin> also pay particular attention to the SIZE of the brush you are using
<Granny-Wicked> als watch for your edges, rhebeka, depending on direction 
you go depends on color you get
<Leapin> if the brush is set too large you may clone areas of the original 
that you do not want
<z-Rhebeka> right, I forgot about the brush size.
<a-roz^> when I am using a paintbrush and a brick effect for example, 
it is hard to get the background a consistent shade.  I cannot just move 
the paintbrush and paint.  I can move the paintbrush but it looks like
 nothing is happening and then all-of-a-sudden the selection where I painted
 turns brick.  In other words, you don't think that anything is happening 
and if you go over the selection you have a double shade of brick.  
There is a lot of he
<a-roz^> I did not check step but it does not appear to be that that is
 calusing my problem.<IMHO>
<Leapin> roz check your step setting to make sure it is not too high
<Leapin> try putting a lower step setting and try again
<a-roz^> I will try... thank you.
<Ghatten> If you want to see a little demonstration of the difference 
in how opacity and hardness work (earlier query) look here:
 http://home.earthlink.net/~ghatten/opahar.jpg
<a-roz^> I have lost of memory and lots of RAM so it should not be
 a memory problem.
<Granny-Wicked> leapin? wouldn't the higher setting on step and a larger 
brush work better? for alignment and no overlapping?
<Leapin> gw no lower would be better

<a-Noel> When I tried your homework suggestions - the oval double button 
- #6 = set contract to 30. All I got was a skinny select which would not 
take a flood fill.Did I miss something?
<Leapin> noel what do you mean by skinny select?
<a-Noel> just a moving skinny line
<a-Noel> no oval
<Leapin> noel did you run out of canvas by chance?
<a-Noel> no
<a-Noel> retried from the beginning several times
<Leapin> try making your canvas larger to start with and than make your
 oval selections smaller
<a-Noel> ok anything else?
<Leapin> or the reverse, if you are having trouble with the contract
<Leapin> make the canvas large enough, but also make your initial ovals large enough
<Leapin> to hold a contract of 30
<Leapin> you could also use the image you have and try to make a smaller contract
<a-Noel> what does it mean anyway?  contract
<Leapin> so you do not end up being a "skinny" selection
<DownEast> Leapin, if the oval is not the maximum width of the the canvas 
(200) the 30 doesn't work.
<Leapin> contract means to make the selection sink in
<a-Noel> that's what i had tho't
<Leapin> the opposite of expand
<a-Noel> thanx i'll try
<Leapin> noel email me the results at graphics@vu.org

<a-candyk> back to clone. how do you set the size of the clone tool?
 and how do i merge selection
<Leapin> candy the size setting is on the clone control palette
<a-candyk> thanks
<Leapin> just move the slider up or down
<a-candyk> now the merge
<Leapin> what do you mean by merge selection?
<Leapin> is your selection floating?
<Leapin> on its own layer?
<a-candyk> when i want to put two selections together
<Leapin> oh like in the snowman example?
<a-candyk> yes
<Leapin> make your first selection
<Leapin> and let go of the mouse button
<Leapin> than to add a new selection to the first selection
<Leapin> hold down the shift key..you should see a little + appear next to 
the selection tool pointer
<Leapin> move the pointer to where you want the new selection to begin
<Leapin> now hold down your mouse key (with shift still pressed) and drag 
out your new selection
<Leapin> when you let go, the second selection will fit in with the first selection
<Leapin> did I explain that okay?
<a-candyk> the old shift key trick! like the snowman. thanks
<Leapin> yes and to subtrack, use the ctrl key

<a-roz^> RE:  Painting with the paint brush-- hesitation.  I tried your
 suggestion about adjusting the step.  The step is at one.  But I did do
 an experiment with the *size* and the lower the size the quicker the brush 
painted the letters2 selection.  Also, how does one get the paint brush 
to paint evenly.  In other words, how would you get an entire screen full 
of letters without having shades between strips?
<a-roz^> I mean overlapping where the strips meet.
<Leapin> roz try turning the hardness up to full
<Leapin> 100 I believe is the highest hardness will go
<Leapin> also make sure opacity is up high
<a-roz^> How about getting overlapping.
<Leapin> roz you want to overlap?
<Leapin> to overlap turn step down until you get the desired result
<a-roz^> I would like to know how *not* to overlap!
<Leapin> roz to NOT overlap turn the step size up higher
<Granny-Wicked> roz, try seting up your ruler, and your grid that might help
<Granny-Wicked> then you can align easier, also zoom in to the area you are
 wanting to work on that might help
<Granny-Wicked> would that help roz leapin?
<Leapin> zooming in is a good idea for any work or at least I always zoom in

<a-Augustus> will we get more in depth instructions on each tool or are we
 on our own now.
<Granny-Wicked> also to set ruler and grid up so she can see her alignments?

-Leapin- how many people do you suppose are here?
<DownEast>  there are  38  people on  #sosstudy

<soapy> Hi: I just added some stuff to my website. the URL is on the bulletin board
<Leapin> soapy I will check it out, thank you!

<a-Noel> When you select the transparent canvas, do you always have the
 gray and white squares behind it?
<Granny-Wicked> yes noel
<Leapin> we will get you
<Leapin> yes that checkered background is called the transparent background
<Leapin> or transparent canvas
<a-Noel> ok, just checking to be sure. Tx
<Leapin> you can adjust the way the checkers appear 
<Leapin> under file/preferences/general preferences
<Leapin> I believe, let me check
<Granny-Wicked> rhebeka hang on we will get to you
<Leapin> if you want to make the checkers appear differently
<Leapin> under file/preferences/general preferences/transparancy
<z-Noel> do you use them to measure?
<Leapin> just play with the features till you like it best
<eagel> I do and grid too
<Leapin> you could do that as well by changing the size of the checkers,
 or just use the grid
<Leapin> the grid is probably more effective for precise measurement
<Leapin> the grid is also adjustable
<Leapin> and can be turned on and off easily
<Granny-Wicked> as well as color of grid
<Leapin> noel is that helping out?

<a-Rhebeka> What is the tranparent canvas for?  It's not transparent when 
you save it!  I have to set the pallet transparency and save as .gif.
<Leapin> the transparent canvas will be discussed in detail in an upcoming lesson
<Leapin> however for now a quicky
<Leapin> the transparent grid is mostly used when you do not want your image
 to have a background colour
<Leapin> whenever you copy a selection from an image with a background
<a-candyk> please tell noel that the checkers dissapear when viewed in browser 
but not in file

<a-candyk> and as my first char, please instruct on how to leave politly
<eagel> To part this channel and stay on mIRC type  /part

<a-roz^> Leapin there does not seem to be much improvement.  I did this before 
and it worked well.  However, I am now using Version 5.0.1 from JASC. 
 Do you think that the version upgrade could be the problem?
<a-roz^> I am still talking about the hesitation.
<Leapin> roz was your question concerning the step?
<a-roz^> The hesitation of brush strokes and overlapping.
<Leapin> oh yes when using the paint brush right?
<a-roz^> right!
<DownEast> Roz, the "hesitation" could be a memory/video problem of you system
 and not PSP5
<Leapin> hmm roz the only other thing I can think of is maybe the image you 
are working on is large, and your computer memory is struggling a little
<a-roz^> I have 8 megs of video and 128 of RAM on a Pentium II 400 mhz
<DownEast> Sheesh!  Souldn't be a problem there!
<a-roz^> The system is 2-3 months old.  Dell
<Leapin> it could be with the way memory is configured though
<Granny-Wicked> I agree with leapin
<a-roz^> How do I check?  Also have lots of programs open at the same time.
<Leapin> check your windows and make sure there is ample space alotted to swapping
<Leapin> roz you will have to consult your windows manuals for that
<Leapin> I am not memory expert, I hardly have any memory of my own
* Leapin says, and I am not talking about my computer memory lol
<Granny-Wicked> roz, my dh said that windows still doesn't know what to do
 with that much memory so maybe configeration problem as leapin said
<Leapin> roz do you have an antivirus program?
<Otter> roz -- try shutting some programs -- your are using up your graphics
 device resources and slowing things down
<Leapin> that boots with startup?
<Leapin> like mcaffee?
<Ghatten> That's what I would suggest..shut programs down before doing 
graphics work...
<a-roz^> I do have an AntiVirus.  McAffee is on here but I also have 
Norton AV not installed.
<Leapin> ghatten I agree with that!
<Granny-Wicked> does mcaffee start up on turning on the computer?
<Leapin> roz mcaffee may be running scans everytime you make a change in psp
<a-roz^> I don't have Mcaffee booting to startup I removed that part of 
it as I was having other problems with the keyboard spacing and we were 
trying all sorts of stuff.  But I might put back the AV on startup.
<Leapin> I'd suggest leaving mcaffee off
<a-roz^> McAfee IS off!  It only runs when I tell it too!
<Leapin> roz than check your memory settings
<a-roz^> I don't feel comfortable with that but I was told to do it that
 way for now!
<Granny-Wicked> That is a good way to do it roz, really
<Leapin> it may simply be that windows can't handle all that stuff you have
<a-roz^> I will try and close down stuff and work with PSP alone and see if
 there is an improvement.  
<a-roz^> I will report back at the next meeting.
<Leapin> thanks roz or email me at graphics@vu.org
<Granny-Wicked> roz, think about this, for everything you do the puter has 
to hold it until you close it down and memory fills fast, the more you do
 graphics the more memory it holds, to close down items helps to release
 memory for other useage
<Leapin> talking of memory
<Leapin> one thing I found in psp 5..
<Leapin> I only have 64 megs of ram
<Leapin> if I do not clear the clipboard and undo buffer every so often
<Leapin> my psp 5 will lock up
<dancin> I agree leapin
<Leapin> I can usual tell this is going to happen when things get sluggish
<Leapin> dancin great than it is not just me :)
<DownEast> How does one clear the clipboard and undo buffer?
<Leapin> so here is how you can clear the buffer and clear the clipboard
<Leapin> in psp 5 when you have done a considerable amount of editing
<Leapin> and you notice your machine is slowing down
<Leapin> click on....
<Leapin> edit/empty/clipboard
<Leapin> and then go back and do
<Leapin> edit/empty/undo buffers
<Leapin> you should see a notable change
<Leapin> the one downfall is once you clear the undo buffers, you can 
no longer undo the last change you made
<a-candy> ha! glad i stayed for that one thanks thanks thanks
<Leapin> so make sure you are happy with your image, before clearing 
the undo buffers
* eagel is sure glad you mentioned that or I would have thought 
I screwed up things again

* Granny-Wicked asks first question for the class ? 
we will also have class on sunday at 6 pm EST? and will this be normal 
class times? friday at 8 pm EST and suday at 6 pm EST?

<eagel> Logs and notes from this class can be found at 
http://members.tripod.com/~MCW_2/EagelsNest/psp

<Leapin> from jayne
<aJayne> when you have an amination you want to transparent is there 
much of a difference in doing so
<Leapin> jayne I am afraid the class will not be covering animation, 
psp 5 itself has far too many features (hard enough to cover em all 
in a short 6 weeks) 
<Leapin> I had to leave the animation software out of it
<DownEast> Perhaps someone else can answer your question in private?
<Leapin> a good place to ask that question though would be in the psp 
users news group

<eagel> Nite all and don't forget to leave you A's and Z's at the door 
 type /nick your-nickname

<dancin> I have a question
<Leapin> dancin what is your question?
<dancin> Will lesson continue to be posted on Wedensdays
<Leapin> dancin and everyone, yes the vu confirmed today that psp lessons
 will always be posted on Wednesdays not Mondays
<Kinkell> does that mean exam etc will be 3 days later too???
<Leapin> I guess that means I get more days to add things LOL
<dancin> How long will the lessons be up leapin?
<Leapin> dancin I did not ask that, but I hope the duration of the 6 
weeks at least
<Leapin> of course I have already discovered some things I will want to change

<Leapin> lesson 2 comes out wednesday

-DownEast- -=SECRET=- Okay, lets fight over this. do you want to do it 
or do you want me to do it --- the student URL page?
<eagel> I will gladly let you do students page
<DownEast> Okay I'll do the page.
<eagel> especiall since I have run out of space at both tripod and geo
 and have to get a new home
<eagel> couldnt even upload songs for this terms pages LOL
<DownEast> This will be for work assignments only.
<eagel> ok
<DownEast> Not a list of homepages...

<Leapin> you know what I should have explained?
<Leapin> the floating desktop
<Leapin> click on the #sosstudy button 
<Leapin> in the menu that pops up click on desktop
<Leapin> now click on the #sosstudy button again
<Leapin> this time select "always on top" from the menu
<Leapin> #sosstudy will now remove itself from mIRC
<Leapin> and become a part of windows 95
<Leapin> you can now resize the #sosstudy window and put it ontop of psp 5
<Leapin> this way you can be doing things in psp 5 and watch the channel at the 
same time
<Leapin> without having to flip back and forth
<Leapin> done
<dancin> You can make psp and mirc vertical also leapin
<Granny-Wicked> vertical is better then horizontal
<DownEast> It worked for me... Took a bit of figuring how to join things back up, 
though.
<Leapin> DE oops forgot to explain that
<Leapin> do rejoin the #sosstudy with mirc
<Leapin> click the #sosstudy button and from the menu deactivate desktop
<Leapin> by clicking on desktop again

<DownEast> If you have a URL that you are displaying your lesson assigments on,
 please e-mail them to me at scotia@ns.sympatico.ca
<Leapin> edit did you learn anything from class tonight?
<DownEast> I will put them all on a web page so that others can see your work.
<DownEast> Send me your class assignment URLs!

<jimbird> I was fiddling with Pirch trying to find something similar to what 
you described for mIRC.
<Kinkell> For Pirch help try
<Kinkell> http://www.ircweb.com/pirch/
<jimbird> Thanks, Kinkell

<Milton_s>  roz^ has a question about how to delete the buffers and clipboard
<roz^> I for how to find where to empty buffer and clipboard in PSP
<roz^> I thought under Edit
<roz^> Edit in PSP.  Not there!
<Leapin> roz yes you are right
<Leapin> in psp
<Leapin> edit
<Leapin> empty
<Leapin> clipboard
<Leapin> than
<Leapin> edit
<Leapin> empty
<Leapin> undo buffers
<roz^> Got it! 

<Kinkell> any hints about the last button Leapin????
<Leapin> kinkell what about the last button?
<Kinkell> the one with the cloud or ocean between the ovals...any hints
 how to copy it???
<Kinkell> guess1 I think it is called
<Leapin> lol kinkell oh that one!!
<Leapin> well we discussed two of the features used tonight
<Leapin> actually 3
<Leapin> one had to do with selections
<Leapin> the other opacity
<Leapin> but to point out, there is more than one way to create that 
exact same button
<Leapin> kinkell try identifying the effects
<Kinkell> I was trying that
<Leapin> do not focus so much on the colours I used, but rather what
 the effects look like
<Kinkell> paint/undo/paint/undo etc etc etc
<Leapin> for instance, what would make the ends bleed into eachother like that
<Leapin> sort of soften into eachother
<Kinkell> wish I knew!
<Leapin> kinkell I am positive you will get it
<Leapin> I know you will investigate until you figure it out

What time is the HTML class?
7-8:30pm PDT,8 mountain,9 central,10 eastern,11 Atlantic
<Kinkell> granny have you a time for your study group yet?
<Granny-Wicked> no kinkell not yet

<Leapin> milton did you find out why the pages were wide in 3.1?
<Milton_S> win 95 IE 3
<Milton_S> no
<Leapin> someone else had the same problem
<Milton_S> netscape 4 does them right
<Leapin> so does msie 4 and 5
<Milton_S> had a DELL with 256 MB ram crash and I had to go help

<zlarry1> Is ther a preference of using the crop tool instead of 
Image--Crop to command?
<Granny-Wicked> yes larry I prefer crop
<Granny-Wicked> that way I can adjust the sides

Session Close: Fri Oct 16 19:01:19 1998