i am a great fan of bone marrow, it contains cysteine and stem cells.

however if you are  myeloproliferative  it mightn't be such a good idea

i am myeloproliferative, that is, i make too many red blood cells and bone marrow promotes this

if you are not myeloproliferative then bone marrow is good

the butcher can saw the knuckles off the end of the marrow bone to make for easy transport home and i just hit the bones with the back of the axe to split them open on wooden blocks on the lawn fending off the feral cats with a stick. you should have the eyes protected as a bone splinter in the eye could be very dangerous.

alternatively the butcher could saw the marrow bone long ways to expose the marrow.

its essential for dog health to, and cats quite like it so there is some competition for it.

just slice and fry.

bone marrow is a sort of cross between meat and fat so it needs to be kept refrigerated and also it freezes quite well. i just put the bones with marrow in in the freezer. when splitting the bones open the marrow should not be too cold or it breaks up and tends to stick to the bone, a bit warmer and it just comes out easily as a whole.

a pecan bread post (9 june 04) titled 'weight loss/Andrew'

"I just got eight marrow bones from the abattoir and axe them open (eye protection needed) and will have bone marrow for the week." (quote from my post ed.)

Who did you tell them it was for this time? For your pet grizzly bear? Or your baby alligator? Oh man Andrew, you crack me up. Happy marrow bone fat week to you!

you do have me thinking though. Can you be sure there's no Creutzfeldt-Jacob risks? Marjan

my reply:

in infected animals its the brain-neural-gut axis that is infected

"The most infectious tissues of cattle with BSE—the brain, spinal cord, and ileum—are now removed at slaughter "

as far as i can see its a neuronal disease which ought to put bone marrow in the clear but will keep an eye open for further information on this.

years ago i remember seeing a national geographic showing how pregnant eskimo women were always given the bone marrow from hunts so i fgured there must be something in it and from expereince i can say there is.

it contains stem cells and glutathione.

its sorta half meat and half fat so it does need to be fresh though it keeps a week in the firdge. freezes well to.

the butcher can slice the bone longways to scoop the marrow bone out (which generally they are not that keen on doing cause it blunts the saw blade) so i just ask for the knuckles to be cut off, you lose a small amount of marrow bone but its easy to transport.

axing them open is a bit of a business but you get plenty of bone for soup stock or even burying around plants as slow release fertisler. the splinters are sharp and some form of eye protection even if it is just glasses is necessary i think.

i slice the marrow bone fat up and gently fry it, you can use the fat that melts out for frying meat and vegs at the same time. but the marrow bone itself is a delicacy, you don't want to lose to much to liquid fat. since i have cooked veges in the fridge i often will just warm them up in marrowbone fat in the fry pan to eat. the liquid fat is a lovely golden brown and quite unlike the supermarket dripping you are used to.

a pecan bread thread (august 17th 04)

What source and how do you get bone marrow? The only thing I can picture is a beef bone you would use for soup. My children can only handle chicken and fish.

my reply:

i get beef bone from the butcher or slaughter house and ask them to cut the knuckles off so its easy to transport, you need to do that as you may want four or five bones or more. cuuting the knuckles off causes minimal loss of marrow as most of it is in the long part of the bone.

they may also cut the bone long ways to expose the marrow so you can scoop it out at home

but i smash them open on the lawn with the back of an block splitter and its sorta fun except for having to beat the feral cats off.

i then shallow pan fry it, you can eat it fryed and then use the melted fat for frying or tossing veges in etc

keeps about the same as meat in the fridge, watch for it going off by a meat like off odour, freezes well in the bone

it really is the most brillant fat

just a bit of lemon juice on the meal seems to cut it nicely

from a who_knows post (14th August 2004)

the other thing is bone marrow has to much iron for me!!!!!!! won't be an issue with some but am cutting way back on bone marrow. if i just fry it and get some of the fat and discard the fiber part, that amy reduce somewaht the amount of iron, but i am still thinking too much bone marrow is not a good idea, you do will have an issue with it being a fat and the accumulation of fat soluble toxins in fat.


K. writes (september 06)

I've made broth lots before but only meat broth, in the crockpot. Today is my first day making real bone broth and I'm not sure it's going well.

I've got a huge pot simmering (lightly) on the stove, with chicken and turkey bones in it plus water and vinegar. The chicken and turkey was originally roasted (some at 350 degrees, and some at 450 degrees because my husband cooks it that way) or crockpotted, and I collected the bones in the freezer. There was lots of scrappy meat, fat, and skin left on some of the bones.

The pot's been simmering for about 6 hours now. At first it smelled good, but now it smells sort of "overdone". The bones have been floating and the ones on top look very brown. (I just stirred them in.) I'm not sure it would be correct to say that the broth smells like the fat is getting rancid, but the broth has a sort of heavy yucky smell that I associate with sort-of-old, very fatty meat that's been overcooked especially at high temperatures.

Is this normal, or have I done something wrong here? I know you're supposed to skim the foam off the top of the broth before using it. If the fat smells yucky, can you just skim it off, too, and strain the broth well, and then go ahead and use it? I can't imagine eating the fat with this heavy yucky smell.

my reply:

i am not really in agreement with recooked bone broths cause there so much calcium in dairy and the marrow will have melted out

twice cooking fat is not a good idea

what i am finding is the most valuable thing in a broth is feral fat if you can get it

first shoot your wallaby with a solid copper bullet to avoid lead contamination

skin it and gut it

and if it has fat along the back wall and preferably yellow for carotenes then slow cook the carcass (first at 300F/147C to heat it up, then at 95C) with not too much water so it renders down into its own liquid for 12 to 18 hours

pour off the liquid to cool, i only keep a couple of small bits of meat for a snack

then fridge it right down to almost frozen so it will keep a week or so

this broth is so rich i can just about live off it, not eating anything else

and because i am high iron , to cut down my iron intake from these very iron rich broths i only use the top half of the semi frozen broth as it is clear and the fine meat particles have settled into the lower half

the fat has solidifyed out onto the top

i think the value of broths is almost entirely bone marrow and carcass fats and in fact its better to get pastured cattle bones, split the open and fry the marrow or use it as a shallow pan frying fat

i used to do this but figured that bone marrow was suprisingly high in iron so stopped it since i need less iron, not more


lamb brains(australian and nz which do not have scrapie) , liver, pancreas, thymus (sweetbread) are what humans evolved eating and our great grandparents ate and needed in the diet. sheep, squid and eyes generally are very rich in vitamin a in the retina. sunglasses in bright sunlight spare vitamin a in the retina. tripe or stomach is very nutritious suprisingly pleasant to eat if fresh. i pressure cook them on my tefal delico at the one setting for 15 minutes with a 6 minute stand down before releasing the pressure. i prefer beef liver to lamb liver.

liver has to be really fresh and is never the same frozen.

very fresh it is sweet and beautiful fried in bone marrow

i prefer beef to lamb liver and i think it is better for you. feral liver like wallaby or esp. australian possum are so far better than farmed animals its sad.

if you follow these pages completely through on what i say you will get as good as you can get but some of things like possum liver once or twice a week can be a tad diffcult for people but it really has the best forms of the b vits , minerals and b-12.

broccoli seems to need to be boiled or simmered, pressure cooking does not work. similarly for potato.


For beef stock I start with a combination of marrow and knuckle bones plus a calf's foot cut into pieces. I put these into a pot with 1/2 cup vinegar and let them stand for one hour. Then I take some meaty rib and neck bones and roast them in the oven until browned. Then I put those bones in the pot with the others and add some onions, carrots and celery, several sprigs of thyme and some dried green peppercorns. I add enough water to completely cover all the bones and bring to boil and then simmer for at least 12 hours, usually longer, skimming off the scum that rises to the top. About 10 minutes before I'm ready to take it of the heat I add a bunch of parsley. It looks a big mess at this point but then strain it and you will have a nice clear gelatin broth. After straining I cool it in the refrigerator and then remove the congealed fat on top and make pemmican or feed it to the birds. This is also quite nice made with lamb bones. I also do a chicken gelatin broth using chicken feet as the gelatin source.

written by CL.

a good quality cream is worth its weight in gold or cis vitmain a and d in season.

winter dairy i find not so good cause of the cold stress and low sun altitude.

i will eat about 150 to 300 ml a day with fruit and every thing. with fats you want to be sure your chromium and other trace minerals levels are adequate to help metabolise them and keep them off the arteries etc.

once you get the hang of high, quality, fat intake, and reduced carbs with some scd emphasis you can do well on two or one meals a day.

an email exchange (27 july 2004) discusssing an unusual reversal of a fecal test

M. writes:

Now I'm very dissapointed with Bioscreen (the test results from a bioscreen-australia test ed.).

First test:02/2004: results: 79.9% Enterococcus. 0% Streptococcus.

Second test:1/7/2004 results: 0% Enterococcus. 71.4% Streptococus

(alpha-haemolityc streptococcus 57.1 % and non-haemolityc streptococcus 14.3%)

How is this possible ? How can this happen ?

my reply:

i think if you are doing raw goats milk that could make a change like that.

in fact i pasturise my fresh goats milk by just heating it up to about 59C then letting it cool

i did drink it raw to start but it starts to overwhelm the natural stomach flora, i think it may be occasionally ok raw but most of the time needs taking up to about 59C, i use a digital thermonmeter to test it

i don't agree with calcium citrate at all, citrate is a yeast feeder, calcium should be got from dairy

from an email exchange (23rd august 04)

S. writes

please read about high glutamate content foods and their role in behavior and autism.

you're quite bright but i do feel that there is a gut damaged population that will not thrive on scd.

read the contents of dev.holistichealth.com

when j. eats low glutamate foods his toes do not curl inward--- however his stools get worse. scd helps his stools but that's about it. his cns goes into a tailspin.

my reply:

i simmer a broth of animal skeleton to get gelatine in the broth which is high glutamine, i don't trust the store bought gelatine

its a great help for healing the gut but you need a balance , too much and it inhibits the dpp-iv digestive enzyme

r u giving the houstonni pep? thats got dpp-iv in.

i do an amplifyed acd, not scd as per the book. if you do it by the book you will die.

a who_knows post (24th august 04) titled 'grapefruit with no fenol a good anti yeast'

like i could feel yeast in the stomach from taking whey in milk too close to bed so i squeeze the juice out from a grapefruit,

drink that through a straw to save the teeth from the acid as i drink it neat

then eat some of the integumement left in the squeezed grapefruit then take a no fenol which seem to help release the anti fungals in the integument

from a who_knows post (5th september 04) in reply to an adult with amalgams and ms asking about supplements

..............but copper has strong remyelinating properties as does fish oil if you can get a decent source, theres very good wild salmon here at the moment (tasmania) just loaded with oil in the flesh.

a lot of the store bough fish oils are quite toxic i think, rancidity and other issues, the effect of the wild salmon is so different.............balanced..............

a pecanbread thread (22 september 04) titled 'gelatin and madcow question'

M. asks:

Does anyone know what the word is on the safety of prions and gelatin? I know that gelatin is made from boiled bones and parts and I would have to assume that would include the spinal cord and such. Are we just taking a chance here? How useful is gelatin for health as opposed to just having a different treat?

my reply:

what i have found is that store bough gelatin is nothing like as good as making your own

its like day and night

i slow cook an australian possum carcass over 12 to 48 hours to make a broth i drink which has a high gelatin content as evidenced by the jelly forming at fridge temps..........

the store bought stuff hurts the gut and the stuff i make myself you can feel healing it

bit of houstonni pep is good after gelatin to help compensate for the inhibition of the dpp-iv enzyme effect that gelatin has

a peacnbread thread (27th september 04) titled 'Butternut Squash Chips: Recipe or Pre-Made?'

S. writes:

i have been experimenting with butternut squash as my little 2 year old desperately misses his crunchies(he literally lunges across the shopping cart when he sees a bag of lay's potato chips... heck, i've caught him in a store trying to open a package!! ;-) ).

i have tried to make banana chips, and butternut squash chips. i am sad to say that i suck at both. :-( when i had some success, the process took so long that i couldn't even begin to describe it(it was total luck).

so.... if anyone has a good recipe for butternut squash chips, please, Please, PLEASE pass it along. of course i would **LOVE** to find them in ready-to-eat packages(actually i would prefer it).

my reply:

when u crisp a surface you get toxic compounds formed and crosslinking of the various compounds in the surface that is not helpful

it does seem to be a rule that where a child excessively likes something , there is an issue with that food, i am not quite sure why.

the other thing to think about with chips is in fact you are eating most of the food as surface rather than interior if you see what i mean and this ties back with the first paragraph in this post

k's reply

I asked Elaine this at the DAN conference and she said that my son is just craving something crunchy and not to worry about it.

my reply:

my thinking about food cravings is that the brain has a sort of browsing cut-out built in, that is by eating something the brain starts to put out stop eating that signals as we eat more

it's there to prevent us eating too much of any one food

so with a craving you get interference of brain function caused by the food that is craved

in all my years of experience with food cravings i have never come across one that wasn't an issue

so i will beg to differ with elaine on this

it wouldn't surprise me if pregnancy food cravings were also related to this since they don't seem to be that functional nutritionally

to make reverse osmosis water palatable, i haven't tried this but probably adding tiny amounts like a few grains of calcium carbonate, epsom salts and plain salt may help to create a similar mineral profile to spring water

be warned that it only takes surprisingly small amounts of epsom salts/magnesium sulphate to have a laxative effect, perhaps it's not suitable and magnesium chloride might be a better choice ?

there is apparently an issue with a chemical from the reverse osmosis membrane getting into the water, this may be the main problem

the process of reverse osmosis is just pressure pushing water through a membrane

a who_knows post titled 'problems with citrus'

this does extend to a more general issue with uncooked fruit like mango is also full of highly biologically active substances

the naringenin in grapefruit and oranges and presumably all citrus has a physiological effect on the body in the quanities normally consumed


i have been juicing maybe four to six grapefruit a day and at least several oranges recently and think it has been making me sweat at too low a temperature and lowering mito function

the basic issue is that these fruits have very significant chemcial modualtors in.............

the easy avaliability of fruit means we get too much and i am cutting right back

i think this issue extends through all fruit though cooking by denaturing some of these compounds will reduce the issues, i notice scd is very hot on cooking fruit

but the amount of fruit juices kids drink these days is a nightmare and must be a very signficant cause of low mito.......

i can see that juicing veges would have similar problems cause the veges juice is uncooked and the biochemical stuff is undenatured.

don't overdo the olive oil, it impairs the sulphur chemistry

pecanbread thread titled 'Frustrated over Coconut sensitivity, and more!!'

coconut is very phenolic

i don't think people take enough account of thier ancestry

europeans don't really have the genes for the proper metabolic breakdown of coconut

bananas have not been ediable for years due to breeding and high pesticide use. well thats the australian ones anyway, in the usa with south american supplies it might be better but the australian bananas suck.

it takes five to ten years of conventional breeding to radically change the food like say bananas and probably another five to fifteen years for that to work through to the consumer

its forty four years since 1960

farmers get paid on weight and the look of the fruit/veg and shelf life

housewives have lost the sense of what food is and cook with spices etc to cover up what taste says is nutritionally empty

if you taste a banana what is it?

i can't speak for the bananas eaten in north america but they are not a food here, often some cardboardy thing that is anti nutritional. if i can find a decent banana i will wait until it is just going ripe and shallow pan fry it

a pecanbread thread (11th october 2004) on glutamine and gelatine

abemom writes:

I received my L-glutamine from Freeda Vitamins today but haven't taken any yet. The recommendation says take 1/4 tsp. of the powder daily for an adult (1000 mg). Does anyone know how much I would give (abemom)

lori replies:

You may wan't to check out Dr. Amy Yasko research on the neurological side effects of glutamine and it's interference with language development at: holistichealth.com

my reply:

the most healing thing for the gut is to simmer or slow cook (i simmer the stock for about 10 minutes then put in an oven @82C for about 24 hours) an animal carcass or parts of a carcass to get a natural liquid high in gelatine with co-factors that is naturally rich in glutamine in a non harmful way

you can drink it as a soup as it is simmering and when it really shouldn't stay in any longer you take it out, cool in a water bath then out in the fridge where it will keep several days

sometimes i will add a level teaspoon of unflavoured, uncoloured gelatine crystals to a hot drink.

you may need some houstonni pep as well to provide the dpp-iv enzymes that gelatin seems to supress

a asd_solutions thread on black cherry extract

A new thing we have been doing in the past couple of weeks is Black Cherry Extract. It is supposed to provide a precursor to the body's production of glutathione. Friends (who know basically nothing about autism) loaned me a book about glutathione. They are into it for other health reasons. They told me that you can take Black Cherry Extract to help your body produce glutathione. But to only take it at night (something to do with the melatonin). The husband takes two tablespoons every night, the wife takes one tablespoon. I was just hearing about glutathione and thought why not give it a try. I bought some. Found it in the health food section of juices and it's basically black cherry concentrate - supposed to be mixed with water to make a juice. I have been giving my son one tablespoon at night. Besides a multi-vitamin, it is our only intervention right now. He has been noticeably more attentive during the day, getting good reports from School. The weird thing is that he falls asleep very quickly after taking it. I've tried it myself and it almost works like a sleeping pill. My husband tried it one night and was up until 4 a.m. I don't know if that was why but he consistently reacts differently to things than normal people do. (Alcohol is not a depressant to him, coffee is not a stimulant - he overdoses on every OTC medication because they have almost no effect on him.) I don't take it every night because I like to stay up past my son and it was making me too sleepy. My son didn't really have sleep issues before this so nothing else really has changed, except he falls asleep faster, wakes up spontaneously for School in a more refreshed state and his speech keeps on improving little by little. So, that's what I have to share, although it's not much because I don't know enough about it as to why it works. I still need to read about that to satisfy my own curiosity. I just figured it couldn't hurt since it's a "juice" basically.

above post by K.

my reply:

black cherries

its 'summer' here in tasmania (not much though!) and there are some acerola cherry and black cherry trees around here (almost too cold for the acerola)

last year i ate a lot of the black cherry when they were quite ripe, made me migrainy and some what incapacitating

this year had some maybe 20 or so not so perfectly ripe and they just about reduced me to crawling :o)

i would be cautious with taking any black cherry extract regularly

they have cyanogenic glycosides which is basically sugar with cyanide in them.......


this may be strongly anti yeast.......

they are medicinal, that is a bit poisionous but possibly quite potent agianst yeast and bad stomach flora and having other benefits like anti-oxidants

but for me one of the not quite ripe black cherries a day is too much and thats spitting the skins out as well

i think the skins being the first line of defense have a much higher toxin level than the flesh.........

interestingly acerola cherries have some of the same toxicity issues i think, only eating two or three of those cherries a day now.........

acerola cherries are supposed to be very high in vitamin c and flavanoids and interestingly lose the vitmain c very rapidly after being picked, within three hours or so.

your husbands opposite response to the black cherry and supplements and medications is not good, sign of liver problems? hope he doesn't have amalgam fillings, could be a sign of heavy metals accumualting there

not in favour of chelation btw, too destructive.

a fine tuned overall supplement approach including my dual selenium protocol works better

nice to be able to post freely here without censorship, ricci whas me on moderation and did not let a post through where i was saying that i thought a very young child on 300mcg of selenium a day was being hurt by such a high amount which i don't think was in the best interest of the child or ambd at all

and those stupid doctors not being able to take being told of all the damage they have done to children with vaccines given too young and such badly designed vaccines, no account taken of the undeveloped nature of childrens immune systems


R. writes (august 06 - open blooms)

Broth and meat intro

I have now given my daughter bone marrow broth four times. Since I don’t have a good baseline it is hard to judge tolerance. I need to replace the rice in her diet, do I just go ahead and plunge in with the whole carcass soup. Will the pep and the Hzyme cover adequately.

Another question, when I introduced egg (soft cooked egg yolk), she woke up the following day with good speech. Lasted two days and then crashed to lot of distress. Similarly with the bone marrow broth, woke up the following day with lot of speech and had three days of perfect brown bms. I increased the quantity to one third cup of broth and then two days later crash. Significant changes with the rice bran enzymes, more periods of sociability, speech, lots of happiness, all this along with frequent periods of distress. Also, has only one bm per day nowadays, whereas comfortable for her has always been two. Also, some gas, not much.

What could be going on here?

my reply

rice in a broth will be a bad combination cause the broth dilutes the stomach acid at the same time as the rice is a fermentative stress

eggs are easiest to digest hard, i have mine almost hard with a touch of soft in

in general i feel broths are better drunk away from meals to avoid the dilution of stomach acid.

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